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The Council of Banking Employers in Romania (CPBR) open letter to the National Authority for Consumer Protection (ANPC)

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2015-02-07 11:40

The Council of Banking Employers in Romania (CPBR), the employers’ organization of the country’s banking sector, hereby publishes the following Open Letter to the National Authority for Consumer Protection (ANPC):

Dear Mr. President of the ANPC, Marius Alexandru Dunca,

The Council of Banking Employers in Romania (CPBR) expresses its surprise in relation with certain interpretations contained in the Press Release* issued by the ANPC on 5 February 2015, in which you bring forward the following conclusion:

“The increase in the value of CHF has immediate effects, which are beneficial to financial and banking institutions, while causing losses to consumers, so that we wish that immediate solutions be found by crediting institutions.” (CPBR translation)

In relation to your conclusion presented above as well as other statements contained in the ANPC release, we hereby state the following:

1. The part emphasized above by the CPBR in the text of the ANPC press release, in which you state that the appreciation of the Swiss franc against the domestic currency would ‘be beneficial to financial and banking institutions’, is a wrong interpretation of the real situation. In essence, this can be interpreted as nothing less than the fact that banks are getting richer on the back of their borrowers when the currencies in which they granted loans (euros, U.S. dollars, CHF etc.) rise against the leu (or the leu falls against foreign currencies), which is false.

2. In order for banks to grant loans in foreign currencies, they are obliged according to National Bank of Romania regulations and internal risk procedures, to ensure financing in the very same currency (from deposits or interbank financing lines), with their assets and liabilities moving in the same direction, meaning that the impact of the exchange rate is non‐existent. Moreover, any payment by banks to cover their sources of financing occurs at market prices, and therefore accepting repayment of past loans at exchange rates different from the market would lead to significant losses for the banks.

3. As concerns the appreciation of the different currencies, we hereby emphasize the fact that it is precisely the negative impact on the clients that have indebted themselves in currencies other than those in which they obtain their incomes, that determined the European Central Bank and the National Bank of Romania to include the evolution of the exchange rate among the well‐known “stress‐test” procedures.

4. CPBR’s member banks that have granted loans in Swiss francs in the past are aware of the existing difficult situation following the appreciation of that currency. These banks have stated that they already started proposing individual, bilateral solutions depending on the situation of their clients and their own situation, under the existing conditions and in the spirit of national and European laws, norms and directives.

Allow us to reiterate our availability, Mr. President, to explain any technical or practical aspects that could contribute to a better understanding of the mechanisms of banking markets, so that the public information exercise can take place with utmost objectivity.

The Board of Directors of the CPBR

CPBR’s member banks are Banca Comerciala Romana, BRD ‐ Groupe Societe Generale, Raiffeisen Bank, UniCredit‐Tiriac Bank, ING Bank Romania and Volksbank Romania. The six banks together own about half of total assets in Romania’s banking system, while their employees make more than a third of all employees in Romania’s banking sector.

* http://anpc.ro/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=831:ce‐solutii‐ofera‐
bancile‐pentru‐clienti‐cu‐credite‐in‐chf&catid=23&Itemid=72

The Council of Banking Employers in Romania (CPBR) is led by Steven van Groningen – pictured (our note)

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ADNANA

Credite in CHF in Ungaria- credite in HUF denominate in CHF

In Ungaria nici acum pentru populatia de rand nu s-a facut nimic .Bancile nu au implementat nimic. Prima hotarare data de guvernul Orban s-a dat ca cei care au credit in CHF sa refinanteze sau sa ramburseze tot la un curs prestabilit ( si aici cei care aveau banii era unitatile bugetare primarii, consilii locale,spitale,etc !!!! care consumau sume mari de la buget ptr plata ratelor de aceea il durea pe Orban )iar cine nu a avut sa ramburseze â€“(adica persoanele fizice care erau prea indatorate pentru refinantare si nu mai puteau imprumuta)platesc ratele lunare la un curs prestabilit , dar diferenta de rata-din dif de curs- se contabilizeaza ca o suma de rambursat ulterior.ROG verificati fiindca asa este am rude care au credite in Ungaria si asa platesc si care asteapta si acum ca OTP Ungaria sa faca ceva ! Un credit in Ungaria era in CHF ca si moneda de referinta , adica contractez un credit de 15 mil de FT prin denominare in CHF la o dobanda si un comision specific sa zicem la OTP Ungaria.( FRANCII ELVETIENI NU II VAD LA CULOARE,nici macar cont in CHF nu am )Rata lunara o platesc in FT echivalent ratei calculate in CHF , la un curs DE SCHIMB INTERN al OTP.De aceea demersul lui ORBAN este justificat sa sara la banci, care nu prea comenteaza, fiindca in aceste conditii creditele au fost o afacere speculativa pe hartie.Faptul ca ei spun ca grosul s-a diminuat ESTE adevarat au rambursat institutiile statului NU PERSOANELE FIZICE care au ramas descoperiti.ROG respectuos sa va informati la sursa fiindca asa este in momentul de fata !!!

ADNANA

ROG VERIFICATI LA SURSA

Ceea ce am mentionat este adevarat , daca controlati la sursa veti vedea ca ceea ce se tot mentioneaza de toti cunoscatorii este nereal ! Dl prof COSEA Mircea - pacat , mi-a fost profesor - cum poate afirma public ca un client trebuia sa stie ca este ceva necurat fiindca este cursul franc /euro tinut de bancara federala elevetiana.EROARE ! Trebuie mentionat acest aspect -creditele in CHF erau demarate in 2005-2008, iar cursul este tinut doar din 2011 ! domn profesor,nu prea ati citit lectia si vorbiti pe langa subiect !Daca faceam asa nu imi dadeati 5...... Iar cei din studio ,printre care si Soviani erau de acord fara sa il combata .Ce sa mai cred ?

ADNANA

Mentiune importanta

Cursul la care ramburseaza un client din Ungaria este un curs intern al OTP Ungaria -daca acolo are credit.Nu are cont in CHF , ramburseaza in forinti la ghiseu.Inca si acum clientii asteapta sa fie convocati de fiecare banca unde au credit ptr noua negociere.Va spun aceasta din sursa sigura.AR FI FOARTE BINE CA DACA COMENTAM SA COMENTAM DOCUMENTAT SI NU SA INNEBUNIM CLIENTII.ORICUM DUPA CUM eavolueaza lucrurile vor veni si debitorii in EUROsi USD la pretentii.SI VA AVEA DE incasat d-l PIPEREA.Asta dupa ce in 2007 daca vorbeai cuiva sa nu ia credit in CHF la maxim se uita la tine stramb ?Iar BNR de ce a avizat fisa de produs -credit in CHF ???Acum sa fie alaturi de banci !

client WCR

Mentiune importanta ADNANA

Dar cand a fost nea Isarescu impotriva bancilor ?????? Si acum BNR s-a spalat pe maini ca este un contract incheiat intre 2 parti......sa plateasca clientii ..... imi doresc pentru o luna ca euro sa ajunga la 10 lei, numai asa o sa se sparga BUBA si o sa aflam dedesupturile, alea SUPRAVEGHEATE de d-l CINTEZOI !!!!!

Vasile Coman

Adnana are dreptate

Adnana ai dreptate cu privire la masurile din Ungaria. Iti multumesc pentru precizari, am completat in articol informatia respectiva, cu link catre articolul din 2011, in care aratam conditiile in care clientii bancilor puteau sa-si ramburseze integral creditele la un curs mai mic decat in acel moment. Intr-adevar, era vorba de rambursare integrala a creditului, nu conversie din CHF in forinti, pierderile din diferenta de curs fiind suportate in comun de guvern si de banci.

ADNANA

Conversie Volksbank /BNR ?

Actionariatul austriac. a decis anul trecut majorarea capitalului social al Volksbank Romania tocmai pentru a demara in luna decembrie actiunea de refinantare a creditelor din CHF in RON , cu un discount din partea bancii de 30/35%(ceea ce a aparut postat pe Internet sub numele de Iceberg ).BNR doar a avizat .Insa din cauza anuntului ca s-a semnat un agreement de preluare a Volksbank de catre BT actiunea s-a stopat.Acum este de urmarit cine suporta diferenta conform planului de atunci ( de vreme ce lichiditatile erau asigurate de actionariatul austriac)fiindca acum costurile sunt mai mari -diferenta de curs este mai mare.Sau se va relua actiunea dar nu la cursul stabilit atunci , fiindca acum sunt altele datele problemei ( cam cu 35% mai mare cursul).Ori suporta diferenta BT ? Ati vazut ca ceea ce mentionam se adevereste , deja cei care au credite in EURO si USD reactioneaza...

talmuc

ObligÄƒ pÃ¢rÃ¢ta sÄƒ converteascÄƒ Ã®n RON ....la cursul de schimb CHF/RON de la data acordÄƒrii creditului

18.12.2014 Ora estimata: 9:00 Complet: C4NLP/PI Tip solutie: Admite cererea Solutia pe scurt: Admite cererea precizatÄƒ. ConstatÄƒ caracterul abuziv al conÅ£inutului clauzei prevÄƒzutÄƒ la art.8.1 din contractul de credit pentru nevoi personale garantat cu ipotecÄƒ nr. C2204/1900/5088/13.09.2007 care prevede sintagma â€žâ€¦.DobÃ¢nda este variabilÄƒ Ã®n conformitate cu politica BÄƒncii. DobÃ¢nda poate fi modificatÄƒ unilateral de cÄƒtre bancÄƒ, luÃ¢nd Ã®n considerare valoarea dobÃ¢nzii de referinÅ£Äƒ pentru fiecare valutÄƒ fÄƒrÄƒ a exista consimÅ£ÄƒmÃ¢ntul Ã®mprumutatuluiâ€¦..â€ ÅŸi dispune Ã®nlÄƒturarea acestuia din contract. ConstatÄƒ caracterul abuziv al clauzei prevÄƒzutÄƒ la art.8.2 din contractul de credit pentru nevoi personale garantat cu ipotecÄƒ nr. C2204/1900/5088/13.09.2007 ÅŸi dispune Ã®nlÄƒturarea acesteia din contract. ConstatÄƒ caracterul abuziv al clauzei prevÄƒzutÄƒ la art.9.1 din contractul de credit pentru nevoi personale garantat cu ipotecÄƒ nr. C2204/1900/5088/13.09.2007 ÅŸi dispune Ã®nlÄƒturarea acesteia din contract. ConstatÄƒ caracterul abuziv al clauzei prevÄƒzutÄƒ la art.9.2 din contractul de credit pentru nevoi personale garantat cu ipotecÄƒ nr. C2204/1900/5088/13.09.2007 ÅŸi dispune Ã®nlÄƒturarea acesteia din contract. ObligÄƒ pÃ¢rÃ¢ta sÄƒ converteascÄƒ Ã®n RON contractul de credit pentru nevoi personale garantat cu ipotecÄƒ nr. C2204/1900/5088 acordat reclamantului, la cursul de schimb CHF/RON de la data acordÄƒrii creditului, respectiv 13.09.2007, urmÃ¢nd ca plata acestuia sÄƒ se facÄƒ Ã®n continuare Ã®n lei. Respinge excepÅ£ia prescripÅ£iei ca lipsitÄƒ de interes. ObligÄƒ pÃ¢rÃ¢ta la plata cÄƒtre reclamant a sumei de 1.150 lei cu titlu de cheltuieli de judecatÄƒ. Cu drept de apel Ã®n termen de 30 zile de la comunicare. PronunÅ£atÄƒ Ã®n ÅŸedinÅ£Äƒ publicÄƒ azi, 18.12.2014.

ADNANA

Talmuc

Sa vedem sentinta definitiva si dobanda la creditul in RON-dupa conversie ......

ADNANA

Ungaria CHF

Ceea ce va spuneam: Abia azi 02.02.2015 se incepe in Ungaria actiunea de conversie a creditelor din CHF in HUF , aceasta dupa ce bancile vor recalcula intai dobanda platita in plus de clienti deoarece nu s-a efectuat o aplicare corecta in calculul dobanzii la CHF-LIBOR -ul scadea dar dobanda clientilor nu era deloc influentata, dimpotriva la unele banci a si crescut. Cursul stabilit pentru conversie este de 256 HUF pentru un CHF -acum este de 294,76.Macar se face ceva.....

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